172 replies to this topic

[abelmartin]

classpad OS 3.0 in www.classpad.tk

[Behnoud]

I found the topic "Classpad OS 3.0", but there was no link
to download
Is it posible to access the english version of site?

[Daniel (CZE)]

I found the topic "Classpad OS 3.0", but there was no link
to download
Is it posible to access the english version of site?

You can use Google translation tool.

[Kilburn]

Apparently, there is no link to download, just screenshots. Let's wait some more weeks.

[Behnoud]

I don't khow how to that
Describe the procedure which I should do.

[Daniel (CZE)]

I don't khow how to that
Describe the procedure which I should do.

1. Go to the main Google page in English language.
2. Click on Language Tools on the right side of the searching box. (or just click on this link: http://www.google.co...age_tools?hl=en )
3. To the field "Translate a web page:" type URL of page which you would like to translate.
4. Select direction of translation (From language to language).
5. Click on Translate button and wait. Translated page will be loaded in a few seconds.

[Daruosh]

I think they are just fake screenshots. No link to download, no descriptions, no links.
here

[rafapa]

I think they are just fake screenshots. No link to download, no descriptions, no links.
here

On the contrary I do not believe Abel is posting fake screeshots. I think he has got a pre-version of OS 3.0 and he wanted to let us know that it really exist.

[mortezahaydari]

On the contrary I do not believe Abel is posting fake screeshots. I think he has got a pre-version of OS 3.0 and he wanted to let us know that it really exist.

what it can do now...?

[PAP]

I agree that Abel is posting ACTUAL screenshots of the 3.0 OS.
You can see from the MENU 3 new functions are add in: Financial, Differential Equation Graphier, and Picture. In screenshots 3 and 4 show you how the Differential Equation Grapher and Picture look like respectively.
Apart from that, there are many improvements to the CAS, Spreadsheet, and Statistics. For example, the Statistics distributions commands are now easier to locate than OS 2.0. Also, many CAS bugs and exactness have been improved upon.
That is all I can say for now. This is still, suppose to be a secret.

Even if the screenshots are not fake (which is quite possible), I don't keep my breath, waiting this OS release. Compared with previous releases, it seems to be better, but... financial functions? for god's sake, is that a great thing? The "Picture" add-in? it seems to be well-designed, but how many times will you use it, even if it is perfect? The most promising thing seems to be the differential equation grapher, but I only see the solution of a very-very simple first-order differential equation. Let's just hope that the screenshot shows just a simple example, and the CAS has been significantly improved, so that more complex differential equations can be solved.
Anyway, I don't want to blame a hypothetical OS release, but I really want to ask something: I have seen many posts in the past, saying that the new OS will have this, and that... HOW DO YOU KNOW ALL THESE THINGS? (several forumers have asked something similar in the past, but nobody answered)

[SoftCalc]

Even if the screenshots are not fake (which is quite possible), I don't keep my breath, waiting this OS release. Compared with previous releases, it seems to be better, but... financial functions? is that a great thing? The "Picture" add-in? well, dosn't seem bad, but how many times will you use it, even if it is perfect? The most promising thing seems to be the differential equation grapher, but I only see the solution of a very-very simple first-order differential equation. Let's just hope that the screenshot shows just a simple example, and the CAS has been significantly improved, so that more complex differential equations can be solved.
Anyway, I don't want to blame a hypothetical OS release, but I really want to ask something: I have seen many posts in the past, saying that the new OS will have this, and that... HOW DO YOU KNOW ALL THESE THINGS? (several forumers have asked something similar in the past, but nobody answered)

Only special hypothetical, the screen shots don't look fake to me.

A financial application will only interest some people, not everyone. There are entire calculators devoted to financial calculation so there is real value here. Even if your interested is focused in math and science you'll probably use a financial application a few times.

A bitmap editor isn't a big feature either, but the ability to embed bitmaps in an eActivity is a nice feature.

The DiffEq Graph application can graph a slope field x'=f(x,t) or phase plane { dx/dt=f(x,y),dy/dt=g(x,y) }. It can graph solution curves for any order equation. It uses a combination of several solution methods, including Rk4 with an adaptive step size.

The UI has improved. The CAS has improved. Numerics has improved.

[PAP]

The DiffEq Graph application can graph a slope field x'=f(x,t) or phase plane { dx/dt=f(x,y),dy/dt=g(x,y) }. It can graph solution curves for any order equation. It uses a combination of several solution methods, including Rk4 with an adaptive step size.
The UI has improved. The CAS has improved. Numerics has improved.

I'm really curious to know what "improved" means. I have a large list of simple integrals that cannot be computed in OS 2.2. I'm also curious about the speed of numerical calculations. Until now, CPLua programs for plotting, solving nonlinear equations, and numerical integration are considerably faster than built-in similar functions. Btw, RK4 with adaptive step size control is a good thing, but what kind of step size control? Richardson extrapolation or something simpler? What about CPBasic? it is still poor and slow, or it has been improved? (I mean real improvement: decent support for user-defined functions, for example). There are many things I want to know. Let's just hope for the best, with hands crossed .

[SoftCalc]

I'm really curious to know what "improved" means. I have a large list of simple integrals that cannot be computed in OS 2.2. I'm also curious about the speed of numerical calculations. Until now, CPLua programs for plotting, solving nonlinear equations, and numerical integration are considerably faster than built-in similar functions. Btw, RK4 with adaptive step size control is a good thing, but what kind of step size control? Richardson extrapolation or something simpler? What about CPBasic? it is still poor and slow, or it has been improved? (I mean real improvement: decent support for user-defined functions, for example). There are many things I want to know. Let's just hope for the best, with hands crossed .

How much of an improvement all depends on who you ask. I don't know how much of your list you can cross off. I assume that there will still be problems the CAS will not solve that you would like it to. Hopefully it will solve all of the simple ones it couldn't before. I have a feeling the improvements to the CAS is a full time job that never ends.

I don't know what type of improvement have been made for CPBasic. Things should run faster, but it will never be as fast as CPLua though. The ClassPad uses binary coded decimals for it's floating point calculations while CPLua uses doubles. This alone will make CPLua at least 4x faster.

The DiffEq solver uses a combination of methods which included Richardson extrapolation for continuous functions without singularities within the interval. Richardson is more accurate and much faster, but not as robust. RK is used as a fallback.

[PAP]

I have a feeling the improvements to the CAS is a full time job that never ends.

Indeed.

I don't know what type of improvement have been made for CPBasic. Things should run faster, but it will never be as fast as CPLua though. The ClassPad uses binary coded decimals for it's floating point calculations while CPLua uses doubles. This alone will make CPLua at least 4x faster.

Some tests I have done in the past show that built-in numerical integration is powerful; for example the integral of abs(x/2+cos(2x)) from x=-3 to x=3 is computed accurately, while Mathematica's command Integrate returns an erroneous result (only NIntegrate in Mathematica returns a correct result)!. However, integration speed is usually considerably slower than a CPLua implementation. I assume that the explanation is the same: binary coded decimals. But why not double float arithmetics?

The DiffEq solver uses a combination of methods which included Richardson extrapolation for continuous functions without singularities within the interval. Richardson is more accurate and much faster, but not as robust. RK is used as a fallback.

Hopefully, we will have a differential equation solver as powerful as the built-in numerical integration.
Thanks for the information. Needless to say that anything about OS 3.0 you can tell to us is always welcome.

[SoftCalc]

Some tests I have done in the past show that built-in numerical integration is powerful; for example the integral of abs(x/2+cos(2x)) from x=-3 to x=3 is computed accurately, while Mathematica's command Integrate returns an erroneous result (only NIntegrate in Mathematica returns a correct result)!. However, integration speed is usually considerably slower than a CPLua implementation. I assume that the explanation is the same: binary coded decimals. But why not double float arithmetics?

When it comes to numerics, Casio is very concerned about accuracy and stability. I'm assuming the person who wrote the numerical integration routines knew what they were doing.

Accuracy is also one reason why they use BCDs. In fact, every calculator that I know of uses BCD floating points. The reason being, we operate in base 10, so the numbers we enter and the results we see must be in base 10. If the computer is using base 2 it needs to convert the input and output which will introduce round-off. Even simple base-10 calculations can give round-off and show results like 0.99999999999 instead of 1. The algorithm to accurately convert between doubles and strings is non-trivial. Some standard libraries (like the one used by Windows) don't do the best job. The one used by GCC is much better.

Another reason for using BCDs is precision. Doubles have a lower precision than the BCD used in the ClassPad.

As an experiment I wrote a graphing add-in that used either BCD, double, or long double. Long double is a data type that is supported by the SH libraries used in the ClassPad (but Microsoft no longer supports). Long double has a high degree of accuracy, even more than the ClassPad's BCD.

When using doubles, the graph was fast. Using long doubles slowed it down by maybe a factor of 2. Using BCDs slowed it down even more. I don't remember how much slower, but my feeling is it was around 5x slower than doubles.

[PAP]

PAP we cannot answer direct cause of the risk we bear to inform forumers here about the OS 3. Even Softcalc also did not mentioned anything; only after my post in December he spilled more beans on this OS3.0. People such as Abel is taking risk to share the info at his site, and there are only a handful of people on the planet has access to the beta. I guess Abel is one of them. (I might be one too, )

Like I said before, I'm not holding my breath waiting for the new OS. Judging form previous releases, and taking into account that the CAS is currently very weak, I don't expect a huge upgrade. I have a feeling that OS 3.0 will need Numerical Analysis functions written in CPLua as much as the current OS needs them.

The reason that TVM is added cause schools from Australia study financial stuff in the school, and hence the influence.

For god's sake, financial stuff now becomes a "science", and money is the modern god. Everybody wants financial functions (bah!), while very few are interested on Numerical Analysis projects, like mine. Never mind, maybe it's better like that.

For example your CPLua is a greatthing I think as many has praise for it.

You are right, but, to be precise, CPLua is Orwell's project. I'm just using CPLua extensively.

[SoftCalc]

Can anyone please explain? is this true?, cause actually, it just says that OS3 will be out "soon"

"Soon" is a relative term. I'm only guessing, but I would think that it would be sometime between now and "back-to-school" (late August).

next question ...... i was a member of this forum once (i was away for a while), now i try to log on but it won't let me , can somebody explain?, any rules that i should be aware of?

There is a member with the name "Giov_Roger". Is this you? If so, you can have your password reset by clicking "forgot password" when logging on.

[Giov_Roger]

There is a member with the name "Giov_Roger". Is this you? If so, you can have your password reset by clicking "forgot password" when logging on.

Thanks SoftCalc
Yes it is me
I'm Back!

"Soon" is a relative term. I'm only guessing, but I would think that it would be sometime between now and "back-to-school" (late August).

that explains it, i guess we'll have to be patient, i just hope its worth the wait

[deweerdt]

The news about ClassPad OS 3.0 on Jeuxcasio.com is a summary of an article extracted from an official Casio magazine which was sent to teachers. In this magazine we can learn more about the date of the official release but Casio don't want to make this date public : we have just the right to say that the release of ClassPad OS 3.0 will be available very soon.

[PAP]

The news about ClassPad OS 3.0 on Jeuxcasio.com is a summary of an article extracted from an official Casio magazine which was sent to teachers. In this magazine we can learn more about the date of the official release but Casio don't want to make this date public : we have just the right to say that the release of ClassPad OS 3.0 will be available very soon.

I would like to know how a "teacher" is defined, so that they know things that everybody else don't know. I have to say that all these rumors and "mystery" concerning the new OS become really annoying. And I don't think that I'm the only one who feels like this.

[deweerdt]

Some teachers (as my teacher of mathematic) has received a magazine entitled 3'33 and the number 57L of this magazine present the ClassPad 300 OS 3.0. This is not a rumor, I have received this magazine and see some screen shot, I tried to scan some pictures but that was not very beautiful.

[PAP]

Some teachers (as my teacher of mathematic) has received a magazine entitled 3'33 and the number 57L of this magazine present the ClassPad 300 OS 3.0. This is not a rumor, I have received this magazine and see some screen shot, I tried to scan some pictures but that was not very beautiful.

No offense, but it is still another rumor for me (no proofs). And I'm really tired hearing self-named "teachers" saying "I know that the new OS will have this or that". I have even seen a post saying "a friend of mine told me that OS 3 will be released at September". For god's sake, it's not so important; they will release the new OS or not. In any case, I'm sure I will still need to use CPLua for "serious" programming.

I just wanted to say that all these statements from "people who know" are really annoying.

[The_AFX_Master]

These lots of annoying predictions are direct consequence of the looong time that we waited for the O.S 3.0..

[girdeux]

August has passed but there isn't OS 3.0. Someone knows something, I supose that no...

[MicroPro]

Not yet. Where are you from?

[samuel]

I have got a single user license of ClassPad Manager 3 professional, a gift from my friend.

The license allows you to both install the Manager on the computer and install the ClassPad 300 with OS 3.0. It is not easy to buy it anywhere yet, but I believe the price for the professioanal version single license is about $60. There is also a basic version which does the same but its Manager cannot open up in Window size. Perhaps the price for the basic version is half of the professioanl version.

I think current owner of ClassPad cannot upgrade from OS 2.2 to 3 for free. You would be required to purchase the single user license for the upgrade.

[vanhoa]

It must be free
The OS must be free
Casio must know they will kill their custommer when sell the os, they will lost he custommer and then TI will be used instead of classpad When I see the os 3.0 sell i will through the classpad back to casio... ... They must know that ...

[SoftCalc]

Let's just wait and see. Maybe it will be free, maybe not. I have heard both so there is no way to know until it is available.

[The_AFX_Master]

I have got a single user license of ClassPad Manager 3 professional, a gift from my friend.

Samuel, The new O.S spreadsheet, or the manager, can link with excel? Can i pass my spreadsheets to excel?

[omegavirus]

Let's just wait and see.

Thats right, but lets hope that we don't have to wait to much...

Maybe it will be free, maybe not. I have heard both so there is no way to know until it is available.

that really s*cks... because that "MAYBE" sounds awfull...

[samuel]

Samuel, The new O.S spreadsheet, or the manager, can link with excel? Can i pass my spreadsheets to excel?

Upon your request, I have tried the following on the Manager ver 3:
Copy and paste a 10-row x 6-column with cell inputs containing alphanumeric into Excel, the result is perfect. However, I cannot paste formula from Spreadsheet to Excel.

Similarly the copy and paste from Excel to Spreadsheet is good. Also, cannot do formula copying.

In fact I have tried the same on Openoffice Calc. The result is just as good with some minor formatting changes.

[DrCoyote]

The license allows you to both install the Manager on the computer and install the ClassPad 300 with OS 3.0. It is not easy to buy it anywhere yet, but I believe the price for the professioanal version single license is about $60. There is also a basic version which does the same but its Manager cannot open up in Window size. Perhaps the price for the basic version is half of the professioanl version.

Let's see...

You have to pay extra for a full version of the connectivity software. (Classpad Manager)

You have to add extra software for decent programmability (as the built in BASIC is fairly limited).

Now, we may have to pay extra to upgrade the OS.

Casio. The Unexpected Extra.

[Orwell]

*thinking about the future price of CPLua*
I hope you are enjoying the free beta phase, cuz it will be over soon




... just joking