55 replies to this topic

[vanhoa]

more info: http://www.audacia-s...de/en/index.htm
download: http://www.casiocalc...amp;load_that=1

[vanhoa]

The memory is OK now, but another problem is "how to send file to flash memory"...

Currently i dont know why pressing the "Find runtime error" makes it exit OWBasic and run an other addin

[vanhoa]

you can try to code yourself by PVMerlin.

[PAP]

How fast is OWBasic, compared to CPLua?

[vanhoa]

very fast, and it supports many thing than Lua (creat windows, timers), you can also make grayscale by it.

[vanhoa]

I finished IEdit - you can write your OWBasic programs by it and test yourself, i'm busy with making a port tool that allow you to port datas to flash....

Download IEdit here.

some specs:

• ZPartner by Alexey Makhmutov (AKA Lerm) is included.
• Search and replace in memo text.
• Hiding horizontal scrollbar.
• External application (e. g. OWBasic) can be called.
• External fonts (in Palm pdb format), keyboards and interface messages.
• "Select all" option, scroll while selection.
• The application data file name can be changed.
• Automatic saving of the edited memo and settings.
• Auxiliary symbols are shown only in edit mode.
• Current time insertion at clock touch.
• "[..]" item in file selection list to allow switching between categories with a wheel.
• Bulgarian phonetic keyboard layout.
• Small fixes and enhancements.
• IEdit is split into cyrillic and european distributions, to keep the size of executable below 64k.
• Line wrapping, hyphenation, right edge alignment.
• Improved interface.
• Hardware icons touch processing.
• Autorepeat in keyboard and scrollbars.
• Medium and bold fonts.
• Ajustable line spacing.
• Delete and merge functions.
• Iconbar with clock.

[The_AFX_Master]

Check that program vanhoa... I get a fatal exception error when i try to call another app. And give some documentation about how to use it please

[PAP]

very fast, and it supports many thing than Lua (creat windows, timers), you can also make grayscale by it.

Yes, but is it faster than CPLua? Have you tried any benchmarks?
I'm not interested on widgets or grayscale.

Check that program vanhoa... I get a fatal exception error when i try to call another app. And give some documentation about how to use it please

OWBasic seems very promising, but the main problem with vanhoa's add-ins is that he creates a lot of them, and none seems to be robust. I think I will keep using CPLua for now. Maybe I will switch to OWBasic if it will become stable, and if it is really faster than CPLua.

[vanhoa]

The program that made fatal error is IEdit, not OWBasic.

[Kilburn]

First, you should abandon the old, tiny, PV interface, and integrate the OWBasic compiler/interpreter with a proper editor in a ClassPad interface.
Could you also distribute the source code ?

[The_AFX_Master]

Vanhoa.. an advise: Never upload an incomplete or bug filled (bugs tht you know) program. it's like spam. We have no need to see a new program every day, but we have the need that every program work without bugs. Give to yourself a week, two or three. But upload a solid program, not an sketch of a program.

The bug in Iedit is unnaceptable, how i can get a fatal exception error by only pressing the keyboard?.. come on dude, you're a promising programmer. but you must put quality higher than quantity in your programming goals list

regards

EDIT..

Btw.. what's going on with CPLua?.. Orwell vanished from the UCF in 2007. someone has news about that?.. I'm scared for the future of the CPLua project

[vanhoa]

First, you should abandon the old, tiny, PV interface, and integrate the OWBasic compiler/interpreter with a proper editor in a ClassPad interface.
Could you also distribute the source code ?

1.To transfer it to CP, you must conv from C to C++, adjust the screen coords... but almost PV drawing function is for PV with 160*160 pixel, so if you want you have to rewrite almost every function of the PV lib, that's hard task.
2.msn.

Vanhoa.. an advise: Never upload an incomplete or bug filled (bugs tht you know) program. it's like spam. We have no need to see a new program every day, but we have the need that every program work without bugs. Give to yourself a week, two or three. But upload a solid program, not an sketch of a program.

The bug in Iedit is unnaceptable, how i can get a fatal exception error by only pressing the keyboard?.. come on dude, you're a promising programmer. but you must put quality higher than quantity in your programming goals list

regards

EDIT..

Btw.. what's going on with CPLua?.. Orwell vanished from the UCF in 2007. someone has news about that?.. I'm scared for the future of the CPLua project

I know that bug, but i cant fix it now. NO MEDIUM/BIG PROGAM THAT DOESNT HAVE BUG!

[Kilburn]

I don't know if this bug will be fixed... Vanhoa is certainly promising, but he seems not to be able to build or fix an addin by himself...
The OWBasic interpreter seems to be promising, but it needs a better interface, and a proper built-in editor.

Orwell is still here, but he is probably way too busy to work on CPLua

[vanhoa]

I build many addins before, but now i think we must increase the number of addins for CP to prove the CP comunity so i prefer porting for now, i 'm fixing the bug, there're some err in the asm source.
@Kilburn: He had an exam i think , wait until the summer. And so that Alexis didnt tell the true to me? (plz login to msn, i'm online from now (8:24am GMT) to 11:00pm GMT)

[vanhoa]

Finally I found my bug!!!
To reduce memory i set the strings to const, when you input st it write data to a const pointer and cause an err.

[Kilburn]

we must increase the number of addins for CP

I would rather say : Increase the number AND the quality...

[vanhoa]

Maybe , but i cant debug it myself, i need report from users to fix it.

And for now, i'm making a program to send PV file to CP (CP flash), would you like to join me, Kilburn? If so i will give you the info

For all, OWBasic systax is similar to Lua and C, you san see thi code (OWBasic Settings):
"! OWBasic Settings" page:

! OWBasic Settings
! VERSION 1.20
! for OWBasic 5.20
! (c) 2006 by AUDACIA Software

!:AUS30,PICON
!>+OWBasicSettings2;
const picon=(12,12,-14823,10533,-14011,12105,-16335,1792,2568,2640,-22750,8,3920,-20702)
const pname$=("OWBasic Settings"," v1.20?by Moritz Beutel??\xDC 2006 by AUDACIA?www.audacia-software.de")
#STD_USED=1
#GUI_USED=0x800F
#M_USED=7
INCLUDE StdMemo
INCLUDE StdGUI
INCLUDE StdLib

#AUTORUN_OFFS=13
const tab=(0)
const cx1=(47,1),cx2=(93,46)
dim switches![7]
const swpos=(3,6,7,8,9,10,11,12)
const swdesc$=("Show statistics","Confirm ESC","Delete overlays","Autorun","Restart","Caching","Search runtime error","Caching when called by IEdit")
local autorun_nm$,wae
const cc=(0,1,2,3,4,5,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,6,7,8,9,10,11)
const pcat=(0),icat=(0)
const imv=(0),im2v=(3,1),v2im=(0,1,0,0)

proc qcat var i
n=m_selcat()
if n>=0 then
i=n
endif
endp

if #OWBVERSION<520 then
error "OWBasic Settings",51
endif
0
tab=1-tab
for n=0 to 7
getsysvar swpos[n],i
switches[n]=i<>0
next
getsysvar 1,pcat
getsysvar 2,icat
getsysvar 4,imv
getsysvar 5,wae
imenu=v2im[imv]
autorun_nm=dup$(' ',30)
for n=0 to 29
getsysvar #AUTORUN_OFFS+n,i
autorun_nm{n}=chr&(i)
next
1
tab=1-tab
2
gui_list_fixed=false
m_allcats=true
m_init
gui_init
gui_head
gui_xbtn 141,1,2
igraph 18,31,14
box 1,26,158,145,6
gui_btn "Save",117,147,157,157,1
gui_btn "Exit",1,147,41,157,2
gui_btn "Restore",72,147,112,157,3
igraph 18+tab,1,14
pset 128,26
drawstring "Options",7,18
drawstring "Switches",51,18
if tab=0 then
drawstring "Program category:",10,32
drawstring "Include category:",10,57
gui_btn m_cnm[cc[pcat]],20,41,149,51,10
gui_btn m_cnm[cc[icat]],20,66,149,76,11
!drawstring "Start up with",10,87
!gui_rbtn "programmenu",imenu,15,97,87
!gui_radio "filemenu",imenu,95,97,149
drawstring "Autorun program name:",10,117
gui_btn autorun_nm,20,126,149,136,12
else
append OWBasicSettings2

"!+OWBasicSettings2" page:

!+OWBasicSettings2
for n=0 to 7
gui_chk swdesc[n],switches[n],10,30+n*9,149,51
next
drawstring "Wait after end",10,106
gui_rbtn "No wait",wae,20,114,149,0,50
gui_rbtn "Silent wait",wae,20,123,149,1,50
gui_rbtn "Wait with message",wae,20,132,149,2,50
endif
show

do
waittouch
gui_qhead
if touched!(cx1[tab],15,cx2[tab],25) goto 1
c=gui_touch()
case select c
case 1 :! Save
 goto 100
case 2 :! Exit
 goto 200
case 3 :! Restore
 goto 0
case 10 to 11 :! Cat
 qcat *(c=10?&pcat:&icat)
 goto 2
case 12 :! AutorunName
 if m_select!(#M_SIG,"! ") then
 autorun_nm=m_name
 endif
 goto 2
endcase
loop until std_repaint
goto 2

100
for n=0 to 7
setsysvar swpos[n],int(switches[n])
next
setsysvar 1,pcat
setsysvar 2,icat
setsysvar 4,im2v[imenu]
setsysvar 5,wae
for n=0 to 29
setsysvar #AUTORUN_OFFS+n,asc(autorun_nm{n})
if asc(autorun_nm{n})=0 break
next
setsysvar -1,0
200
restart 0

Screen shot of this prog:

[vanhoa]

It also have a library for better prog: OWBasic Standard Library
Document here: http://www.audacia-s...sl_e_intro.html

Some games were made by OWBasic:

SUPAPLEX:
footplayer:
Acquire:
Galactica:
Block-Buster:
PV Train:

and others like Pv Counter-Strike (The_Afx_Master and PAP's favorite PC game... ) , LodeRunner, Space Runner, Race 2000, AEPocketBomber...

Some progs:
FuncGraph:

and others: PBasic, Graustufen,...

And also library, document... which will be avaiable when i fnished the transfer tool.

[The_AFX_Master]

and others like Pv Counter-Strike (The_Afx_Master and PAP's favorite PC game... )

LOL!... i'll try that!

Vanhoa, i know that a big program have bugs.. it's normal.

[PAP]

Yes, but is it faster than CPLua? Have you tried any benchmarks?

No, he obviously didn't.

Vanhoa.. an advise: Never upload an incomplete or bug filled (bugs tht you know) program. it's like spam. We have no need to see a new program every day, but we have the need that every program work without bugs. Give to yourself a week, two or three. But upload a solid program, not an sketch of a program.
The bug in Iedit is unnaceptable, how i can get a fatal exception error by only pressing the keyboard?.. come on dude, you're a promising programmer. but you must put quality higher than quantity in your programming goals list

I totally agree. But I'm afraid that vanhoa's first priority is to announce new addins as fast as possible, and he doesn't really care about quality. Can you imagine vanhoa "giving himself a week, two or three", instead of uploading a "sketch" of a program every day?

Btw.. what's going on with CPLua?.. Orwell vanished from the UCF in 2007. someone has news about that?.. I'm scared for the future of the CPLua project

I'm also wandering what's happening. For now, let's say that Kilburn knows what he says, so CPLua isn't abandoned (or sold) yet.

I know that bug, but i cant fix it now.

For god's sake, read what you wrote. Just see your own posts; most (if not all) of them go like this: "here is my new addin, it's buggy, but I don't have the time to fix it", and the next very day: "here another new addin, it's also buggy, but I don't have the time to fix it", etc, etc, etc. Always the same. It is a pity, because you are indeed a promising programmer. Don't expect user reports if you continue to do this. I certainly won't try your addins, unless you stop that "new addin frenzy", and take your programs much more seriously. My advice is: upload something finished, tested, and well debugged, or don't upload anything; it's not a crime to leave a day pass without announcing a new (buggy) addin.

NO MEDIUM/BIG PROGAM THAT DOESNT HAVE BUG!

Come on, every programmer knows that, but what you are doing is different. You know in advance that your program is buggy, but you are still uploading it, in a post full of triumphing fireworks.

and others like Pv Counter-Strike (The_Afx_Master and PAP's favorite PC game... )

I want to see that, although I don't expect to like it. Btw, if you want a free Counter-Strike-like game, try ActionCube. It's very good, and open source.

[The_AFX_Master]

I'm downloading the game.. seems to be small!! 18mb

[PAP]

Yes, it's small, and has good graphics and game play. Also try Sauerbraten. It has amazing graphics. Both games are very light and fast, due to their excellent 3D engine. You can play efficiently with an old computer and a simple modem.
Just to see the power and quality of Open Source...

[The_AFX_Master]

ending offtopic.. PAP, you know a game that comes packed in 100 kb or less? and is FPS.. i saw it some time ago.. and i was amazed!!! tremendous graphics and sound in 100 kb!

[vanhoa]

My recent addins is not buggy (..., JessBall, Grav, OWBasic), they are ported from Ti or PV and tested by many people, Only IEdit - its main author hasnt finished it.

I know my addin is buggy, but that was the past.

[PAP]

ending offtopic.. PAP, you know a game that comes packed in 100 kb or less? and is FPS.. i saw it some time ago.. and i was amazed!!! tremendous graphics and sound in 100 kb!

Yes, I saw that game about 2 years ago or something similar. It had just one short map, excellent graphics, and of course no install, just click and play. If I remember well, that was a very early version of Sauerbraten. Its final version is much bigger (today's <{GNULINUX}> version is about 138 Mb), but it is still very small, compared to commercial games, and if you see the graphics you won't believe that it is a free OpenSource game.

[girdeux]

I'm agree with that Vanhoa should increases the quality and not the amount, I can't follow all his add-ins, there are too...

Correct me if I'm wroung, Owbasic is an addin like CPLua, it is to say, a programming language no? what are the advantages of Owbasic respect CPLua? (sincerely I have no desire to learn other programming language, I'm not a programmer). And what's IEdit??

And what about PVMerlin, what can I do with this add-in??

Thanks for the information I don't like install add-in without know what I can do with it.

[Kilburn]

How fast is OWBasic, compared to CPLua?

Slower. I tried to fill a 100x100 rectangle with the pixel drawing function, CPLua is much faster than OWBasic.

very fast, and it supports many thing than Lua (creat windows, timers), you can also make grayscale by it.

Timers, grayscales, sound, serial communication, flash memory management, external add-in calling are simple gadgets that can be very easily implemented in CPLua.

Correct me if I'm wroung, Owbasic is an addin like CPLua, it is to say, a programming language no? what are the advantages of Owbasic respect CPLua? (sincerely I have no desire to learn other programming language, I'm not a programmer). And what's IEdit??

OWBasic is a simple program compiler/interpreter, while CPLua also provide a program editor. IEdit is a text editor. So you will have to run IEdit, type your program, save it, then run OWBasic, and run your program.
OWBasic has procedures that can access flash memory, buzzer, timers, internal memory and ports, serial communication... But it's much slower than Lua, and the ClassPad keyboard is unusable because this program has been designed for Pocket Viewer, that doesn't have a hard keyboard.
Moreover, as I've just said, these procedures can be easily implemented in CPLua.

And what about PVMerlin, what can I do with this add-in??

PVMerlin is a text/contact editor that supports handwriting.

[TacoFred]

http://212.202.219.162/kkrieger

Thats the link to the site for the <100KB game

[PAP]

Slower. I tried to fill a 100x100 rectangle with the pixel drawing function, CPLua is much faster than OWBasic.

Ok, it is slower in pixel drawing, but what about mathematical calculations?

Timers, grayscales, sound, serial communication, flash memory management, external add-in calling are simple gadgets that can be very easily implemented in CPLua.

Hmmm, I' m not so sure that all these things are simply gadgets, and I don't think they can be easily implemented in CPLua.

the ClassPad keyboard is unusable because this program has been designed for Pocket Viewer, that doesn't have a hard keyboard.

...and the CAS is not supported as well, I guess . If OWBasic is indeed slower than CPLua, even in mathematical calculations, there is no need to install it, although it looks interesting.

[PAP]

http://212.202.219.162/kkrieger
Thats the link to the site for the <100KB game

Yes, that is indeed the 96 kb 3D game. Unfortunately, it is in very early development, and it seems that it will remain like that for a long time .

[vanhoa]

I can add CAS easily, it's not the problem.
And I dont think it's slower, the 'show' function which copy all drawing function from VRAM to DD delay the program execution.

[vanhoa]

try this code:

OWBasic:

for i=1 to 160
for j=1 to 160
pset i-1,j-1,1
next
next
show

vs

CPLua:

require "draw"
showgraph()
draw.onbuffer()
for i=1,160 do for j=1,160 do
draw.pixel(i-1,j-1,1)
end end
draw.update()

[vanhoa]

In the other way, the number of user of OWBasic is more than CPLua.

[The_AFX_Master]

graph functions aren't a feasible proof (at least for me) that OWBasic is faster than CPLua. Is known that the routines for drawing on CPLua are written in C++ (thus, the hardware access is limited). A routine written on ASM will make it a lot faster

[Orwell]

Who said I wasn't here anymore?
I check the forum everyday, but I'm not allways logged on

Btw.. what's going on with CPLua?.. Orwell vanished from the UCF in 2007. someone has news about that?.. I'm scared for the future of the CPLua project

I'm also wandering what's happening. For now, let's say that Kilburn knows what he says, so CPLua isn't abandoned (or sold) yet.

Sold? Hmm... now that you think about about it...
No, nothing has been abandonned nor sold. I'm just horribly busy this year (I'm currently developping 4 or 5 different projects at the same time, and I need to complete my thesis), and on top of that I had to look for my futur job (which I found now, yay ).
I will spend 2 monthes in the summer to complete CPLua and give you a final release. Sorry to make you wait until then

Now, some reactions about your quotes (no much time for that now, I'll come back later):

Timers, grayscales, sound, serial communication, flash memory management, external add-in calling are simple gadgets that can be very easily implemented in CPLua.

Hmmm, I' m not so sure that all these things are simply gadgets, and I don't think they can be easily implemented in CPLua.

Implement some new features in CPLua isn't really difficult... The main problems concern the interface with the Lua language (a nice feature is useless if it's a headache to use it correctly) and from the size of the Add-in, which cannot be too large.

I tried to fill a 100x100 rectangle with the pixel drawing function, CPLua is much faster than OWBasic.

IMHO you shouldn't write benchmarks based on call to the language libraries. Do some tests with simple programs like

a  = {}
for i = 1,100000 do a[i] = i*i end

to see the real speed of the interpreter itself

[vanhoa]

Sorry Orwell, i'm not flaming your project.

OWBasic : 4s

a=0
for i=0 to 100000
a=i*i
next
for i=0 to 159
for j=0 to 159
PSET i,j,1
next
next
show

CPLua: 19s

require "draw"
showgraph()
draw.onbuffer()
a=0
for i=0,100000 do a=i*i end
for i=1,160 do for j=1,160 do
draw.pixel(i-1,j-1,1)
end end
draw.update()

The ClassPad keyboard is unusable because this program has been designed for Pocket Viewer, that doesn't have a hard keyboard.

It is not unusable! CPLua can add more function, and OWBasic can too, i can add hard keyboard functions easily.

[vanhoa]

WOW, i've found an interesting function

PLAY mel$,dur%,vol%

Plays a melody coded in mel. The characters have the following meaning.
Character Meaning
'a'..'h' Play the corresponding note
'#' Increment next note a half step (cis, dis..)
'+' Change to next higher octave
'-' Change to next lower octave
1 Select whole notes 1/1
2 Select half notes 1/2
4 Select quarter notes 1/4
8 Select eighth notes 1/8
6 Select sixteenth notes 1/16
' ' or 'p' Play a rest
'r' Reset to default value

The parameter dur controls the duration (in milliseconds) of the sound. The parameter vol controls the volume or waveform of the signal. The value 100 is the highest volume.

example: PLAY "4ee2e4ee2e4egcd2e4ffffeeeeedde2dg",1400,100

enjoy

[Orwell]

I already know that draw.pixel() will be slower than a function PSET which is written in ASM and draws directly on VRAM.

What I what to know is the performance of the interpreter itself, not the performance of that specific function
Moreover, I suggested a code which continuously increase the size of a vector. This is not a really simple operation.
What you wrote here is

a=0
for i=0,100000 do a=i*i end

which is considerably simpler.

Sorry Orwell, i'm not flaming your project.

I'm not worried at all

[vanhoa]

but it require 200k byte for just a test @-)


And OWBasic compile the code before run so it should be faster

[Orwell]

And OWBasic compile the code before run so it should be faster

It cannot be a real compilation, it's just a tokenizing operation. CPLua does the same thing